Author Topic: Six Pack issues and rebuilding  (Read 89642 times)

Offline Chryco Psycho

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #45 on: February 08, 2014 - 08:57:26 am »
once you remove the needle & seat by unthreading it from the top of the carb the float & pivot pin should slide right out , Make sure you match up the gaskets as you change them , the Holley kits will have different choices for base gaskets & maybe metering block gaskets as well .
 When removing the carbs work from the back , the rear is the last carb to install & the first to come off .
  I am not sure the bronze filter help or hurt .
 Jetting around 64 center & 80 outboards seem to be about right , 6.5 powervalve should be normal unless the cam is more aggressive , the PV should be at least 1.5" below the manifold vacuum reading at idle in gear if auto

Challenger - You`ll wish You Hadn`t




Offline HP_Cuda

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #46 on: February 08, 2014 - 02:21:51 pm »

If you are worried about fuel debris you could filter before the carbs. i doubt it was a lack of those bronze filters.

But I do haveto ask when the problem occured how full was your tank?

B
1970 Cuda Clone 440 4 speed - sublime green
1970 Cuda 383 4 speed - yellow - SOLD

Offline tommyg29

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #47 on: February 08, 2014 - 03:18:52 pm »
Thanks Chryco, my existing jets are big at 80 inboard, 86 outboard, but I will start with your suggestion.
The build is mild, close to stock but with headers and 3" exhaust. Also, my choke is disconnected and I will keep it that way.
The fuel tank had about 1/8 (I think) when it happened.
Its hard to tell with the gauge not being the most accurate.

Just waiting on glass sight plugs, fuel lines and bronze filters, then have to pick up a few jets and I should be ready to start reassembling.
I will use my old fuel lines to get them tuned right, and when I know everything is working well will put the new lines on.
I'm thinking it will be best to get the entire fuel line assembly put together on the bench, carefully using teflon on the threads, and then installing the whole assembly as one unit.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2014 - 05:05:00 pm by tommyg29 »
72 Roadrunner 400-4 Auto-3.23 Gear-Black Cruiser
71 Cuda 440-6 Tribute-Limelight-A833 Close Ratio-4 Sp-Pistol Grip-Dana 3.54 Powr Lok-Rally Dash-Shaker (Sold)
92 Dodge Stealth RT-Twin 15g Turbos-SAFC2 Tuned-Mystic Blue-5 Sp-AWD-Rear Wheel Steering-AutoX'r (Sold)
12 Dodge Charger SXT Plus Blacktop Package-3.6L-8 Sp-Leather-Nav (the wife's)

Multiple SRT's, Rams, Dakotas, Caravans and Neons

...the lines on the road just look like dots!....

Offline tommyg29

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #48 on: February 09, 2014 - 11:45:53 am »
HP
You have a six pack on your 440?
What jets are you running?
72 Roadrunner 400-4 Auto-3.23 Gear-Black Cruiser
71 Cuda 440-6 Tribute-Limelight-A833 Close Ratio-4 Sp-Pistol Grip-Dana 3.54 Powr Lok-Rally Dash-Shaker (Sold)
92 Dodge Stealth RT-Twin 15g Turbos-SAFC2 Tuned-Mystic Blue-5 Sp-AWD-Rear Wheel Steering-AutoX'r (Sold)
12 Dodge Charger SXT Plus Blacktop Package-3.6L-8 Sp-Leather-Nav (the wife's)

Multiple SRT's, Rams, Dakotas, Caravans and Neons

...the lines on the road just look like dots!....

Offline cudabob496

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #49 on: February 09, 2014 - 04:04:18 pm »
just for info, and I don't have a six pack, but on my 496 the jets on my Holley 850 DP,
are 78/84, and that's dialed in with an AFR meter. Engine should be over 600 hp.
72 Cuda, owned 25 years. 496, with ported Stage VI heads, .625 in solid roller, 254/258 at .050, 3500 stall, 3.91 rear. 850 Holley DP, Reverse manual valve body.

1999 Trans Am, LS1, heads, cam, headers, stall, etc! Love to surprise the rice rockets with this one. They seem so confident, then it's "what the heck just happened?"

2011 Kawasaki Z1000

Offline cudabob496

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #50 on: February 09, 2014 - 04:33:52 pm »
I remember in 1970 I saw my first Cuda, a lime green one, jacked up with Cragers, pulled into
our 76 gas station.  Thought it was the most beautiful car I ever saw.  Had to wait
till 1991 to get one, though.

Anyway, beautiful green Cuda above!
72 Cuda, owned 25 years. 496, with ported Stage VI heads, .625 in solid roller, 254/258 at .050, 3500 stall, 3.91 rear. 850 Holley DP, Reverse manual valve body.

1999 Trans Am, LS1, heads, cam, headers, stall, etc! Love to surprise the rice rockets with this one. They seem so confident, then it's "what the heck just happened?"

2011 Kawasaki Z1000

Offline HP_Cuda

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #51 on: February 10, 2014 - 12:31:20 pm »
No I'm selling my 6 pack intake and I have a 4 barrel.

I'd say stay close to the stock jetting that came with the carbs. Unless you did something radical to the motor (cam, exhaust, etc) then I wouldn't worry about it.

I found this and if you search on R4670 you will see that the stock primary jet is a 62. Just food for thought.
http://www.holley.com/data/TechService/Technical/Carb%20Numerical%20Listing.pdf

B


HP
You have a six pack on your 440?
What jets are you running?
« Last Edit: February 10, 2014 - 12:51:00 pm by HP_Cuda »
1970 Cuda Clone 440 4 speed - sublime green
1970 Cuda 383 4 speed - yellow - SOLD

Offline tommyg29

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #52 on: February 10, 2014 - 09:14:51 pm »
No I'm selling my 6 pack intake and I have a 4 barrel.

I'd say stay close to the stock jetting that came with the carbs. Unless you did something radical to the motor (cam, exhaust, etc) then I wouldn't worry about it.

I found this and if you search on R4670 you will see that the stock primary jet is a 62. Just food for thought.
http://www.holley.com/data/TechService/Technical/Carb%20Numerical%20Listing.pdf

B


Thanks again,
I think I have everything either on my work bench or on its way, except needles. The ones I have seem ok, and the rebuild kit comes with new needle seals, but shouldnt the needles be replaced also?
Even though Ill probably never need 90 percent of them, I broke down and bought a kit of jets from 65-82. It was the smallest and therefore the cheapest set I could find on ebay. So It looks like I will try 65s and 80s for the outboards, since I already have a pair of 80s from my inboard.
Might as well check my ignition system while the top of the motor is naked, so I picked up a timing light. 12/36 are the numbers I should expect there. Not going to fool with the advance. Its a great msd billet distributor and Im gonna assume the centrifugal was set up well.
I have been getting a little run on lately after turning off the key, and from what I understand it may be because the msd system is passing on a residual charge. The fix has something to do with the ballast resistor, which I disconnected years ago.

I HATE run on. Its pretty embarrassing when you pull into a cruise and turn off the key, only to have it choke itself to death over the next few moments. At least its not as bad as  the emission strangled 1974 350 camaro I had in high school (my first car). It was such a dog, it often took almost a minute to choke itself off. My buddies would laugh and laugh, but I was rarely amused.
« Last Edit: February 10, 2014 - 09:22:37 pm by tommyg29 »
72 Roadrunner 400-4 Auto-3.23 Gear-Black Cruiser
71 Cuda 440-6 Tribute-Limelight-A833 Close Ratio-4 Sp-Pistol Grip-Dana 3.54 Powr Lok-Rally Dash-Shaker (Sold)
92 Dodge Stealth RT-Twin 15g Turbos-SAFC2 Tuned-Mystic Blue-5 Sp-AWD-Rear Wheel Steering-AutoX'r (Sold)
12 Dodge Charger SXT Plus Blacktop Package-3.6L-8 Sp-Leather-Nav (the wife's)

Multiple SRT's, Rams, Dakotas, Caravans and Neons

...the lines on the road just look like dots!....

Offline mopar jack

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #53 on: February 10, 2014 - 09:28:09 pm »
Run on is very much like a diesel and doesn't need ignition. Winter grade gasoline seems to cause a lot of run on due to the increased vapor pressure needed for the cold atmosphere. I usually turn the car off with it in drive (auto) and that puts enough load on the motor to stop without run on. The factory added a solenoid to the throttle to solve this problem.

Jack

Offline HP_Cuda

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #54 on: February 10, 2014 - 09:30:34 pm »
I'd replace the needle and seats nyway so you can rule it out going forward.

Sounds like a plan for the jets, who recomenned 80's for the outboards?

Yeah it sounds like you might need some timing work to remedy that lovely dying cough when you shut her down. If you have the pro billet msd like mine you will have to set up springs for the mechanical advance otherwise you have a vacuum advance and nothing to worry about.
1970 Cuda Clone 440 4 speed - sublime green
1970 Cuda 383 4 speed - yellow - SOLD

Offline cudabob496

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #55 on: February 10, 2014 - 09:34:06 pm »
I would get ocassional run ons, but now I have an on/off switch to my
MSD box, and when I flip that switch off, the engine quits immediately.
72 Cuda, owned 25 years. 496, with ported Stage VI heads, .625 in solid roller, 254/258 at .050, 3500 stall, 3.91 rear. 850 Holley DP, Reverse manual valve body.

1999 Trans Am, LS1, heads, cam, headers, stall, etc! Love to surprise the rice rockets with this one. They seem so confident, then it's "what the heck just happened?"

2011 Kawasaki Z1000

Offline tman

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #56 on: February 10, 2014 - 09:38:43 pm »
Could be other reasons for dieseling.  Here are some but you can look up other for solutions.  Switch for MSD is an easy one.  If its not that, then here are other things to do.

http://www.ehow.com/how_7798617_stop-car-dieseling.html

Offline tommyg29

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #57 on: February 10, 2014 - 10:04:49 pm »
If I have been getting dieseling, everything Im doing will probably put a stop to it, including new plugs gaped at 48-50ish
The prior owner used jets of 80s inboard and 86s outboards so you could say it was running rich, and that may have contributed to my problems.
Chryco recommended 80s and I have read that recommendation elsewhere also for my setup.
72 Roadrunner 400-4 Auto-3.23 Gear-Black Cruiser
71 Cuda 440-6 Tribute-Limelight-A833 Close Ratio-4 Sp-Pistol Grip-Dana 3.54 Powr Lok-Rally Dash-Shaker (Sold)
92 Dodge Stealth RT-Twin 15g Turbos-SAFC2 Tuned-Mystic Blue-5 Sp-AWD-Rear Wheel Steering-AutoX'r (Sold)
12 Dodge Charger SXT Plus Blacktop Package-3.6L-8 Sp-Leather-Nav (the wife's)

Multiple SRT's, Rams, Dakotas, Caravans and Neons

...the lines on the road just look like dots!....

Offline cudabob496

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #58 on: February 10, 2014 - 10:15:54 pm »
If I have been getting dieseling, everything Im doing will probably put a stop to it, including new plugs gaped at 48-50ish
The prior owner used jets of 80s inboard and 86s outboards so you could say it was running rich, and that may have contributed to my problems.
Chryco recommended 80s and I have read that recommendation elsewhere also for my setup.

try backing off the total timing a few degrees.  Too much advance can cause it.
72 Cuda, owned 25 years. 496, with ported Stage VI heads, .625 in solid roller, 254/258 at .050, 3500 stall, 3.91 rear. 850 Holley DP, Reverse manual valve body.

1999 Trans Am, LS1, heads, cam, headers, stall, etc! Love to surprise the rice rockets with this one. They seem so confident, then it's "what the heck just happened?"

2011 Kawasaki Z1000

Offline HP_Cuda

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Re: May have over revved the engine- fuel issue?
« Reply #59 on: February 11, 2014 - 11:56:02 am »

Good place to start but you may have to go lower on your jets depending on how your motor responds to the outboards.

If I have been getting dieseling, everything Im doing will probably put a stop to it, including new plugs gaped at 48-50ish
The prior owner used jets of 80s inboard and 86s outboards so you could say it was running rich, and that may have contributed to my problems.
Chryco recommended 80s and I have read that recommendation elsewhere also for my setup.
1970 Cuda Clone 440 4 speed - sublime green
1970 Cuda 383 4 speed - yellow - SOLD