Author Topic: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!  (Read 741 times)

Offline chaps70rt

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Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« on: May 17, 2020 - 08:12:12 AM »
Yesterday was the perfect day to take out the Challenger for the first spin of the spring.  It has been on a battery tender for the winter
and fired up as usual.   I warm up the car in the driveway and off I go.  Drive about 3 miles make a turn to return home and have it in
4th gear and it begins to lose power or stalling.   I gear down and have no power .. I pull on to the gravel and car is completely dead.  No power to turn over the starter, yet my 4-way flashers work.  I'm thinking that the battery has quit or that the alternator is not working.

I'm at the side of the road sitting and wondering how I am going to get home.   Along comes a guy in a '67 GTX and asks me if I am okay?
Of course I say "NO".  He pulls over and we check the battery (12.1 Volts).  We are discussing possibility of having to tow.  Car sits for another 10 minutes as we go through the list of possible issues, then I try to turn it over it starts, then dies again after a few seconds and again it won't turn over.    I let is sit for another 5 minutes (at this point the car has cooled down). I try to start it again and it runs.   He agrees to follow me back to my garage and the car seems fine.  Now what??

Where do I start with the diagnosis???  Has anyone experienced a similar situation?   This is the first time this has happened.
I am running an electronic distributor and have a Mopar chrome VR and mini starter (all new parts) on my 440 with a carb (no EFI).

Voltage Regulator?  Starter too hot? Bad connection?  Seems like a bad ground, loose connection, but not sure if there are some
common places to start given the above description of my breakdown.  Thanks in advance . Gary 
White 1970 Challenger R/T
440 - 4BBL - Shaker
Daily Driver - 2014 Dodge RAM 1500
Stouffville, Ontario Canada




Offline dodgedream

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #1 on: May 17, 2020 - 09:24:51 AM »
Sorry to hear about the bad luck but you got to meet a fellow Mopar enthusiast. I would look at where the power goes thru the fusebox first, that seems to corrode on the cars if it is original and would be a good place to start troubleshooting

Offline 70chall440

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #2 on: May 17, 2020 - 11:49:03 AM »
Absolute, I would start with the wiring harness from the steering column down to the firewall, there is a somewhat long/wide connector (connects the column with the harness), look at this very carefully to ensure that the all of the pins are in good shape and clean, specifically the large red wire. If this is good, move over to the inside of the engine compartment and look at where all of the wires and blocks are connected to the firewall block paying particular attention to the engine harness (the block that provides the connections to the engine specifically). There may be some errant wires (meaning wires that are not coming from the block, rather they are individuals or potentially several wires together coming through the firewall through a grommet or something). Another way to look at it is to trace the wires from the starter relay back to the firewall as well as the wires from the ballast resistor back. You may need to get under the dash and check the other side of the block as well.

Bottom line, you have a loose and/or corroded connection somewhere in all of this. There really isn't a lot of possibilities, it is most likely the wires coming from the column.
Current Mopar
70 Challenger RT 440-6 EFI, 73 Cuda 416-6 EFI
05 Hemi Durango, 01 Ram 4x4, 14 Ram 2500 4X4, 10 PCP Challenger 6 spd RT, 01 Viper GTS ACR, 52 B3B w/330 Desoto Hemi, 70 Hemi RR (under const)
Past Mopars
9 x Challengers. AAR Cuda, 4 RR, 2 GTX, 4 Chargers, etc... (too many to list)

Offline 73440

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #3 on: May 17, 2020 - 01:15:10 PM »
I have had a coil not work properly when the engine was hot then would start back up when it cooled down .
do you have an extra coil to check with ?
67 440
72 413 / 727
73 Barracuda w/ 68 440
65 Plymouth Fury III , I sold ,was my Nana's car till 92 yo.
51 Ford F1 239 Flathead, flipped , new cab , stolen
59 BelAir 283 4 door original patina
01 Chevy van 420, 520 miles
06 Crown Vic Police Interceptor
75 HD Ironhead converted to RH shift
73 HD Ironhead
82 HD Ironhead
74 Norton 850
80 HD Shovelhead
80 Husqvarna WR 390

Offline 'Cuda Hunter

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #4 on: May 17, 2020 - 01:29:59 PM »
I would suspect the coil myself.  Since this seems to be heat related.

Wires could be possible but usually if that is the case it doesn't restart by just sitting.  You would have had to been moving them around to get connections touching again. 

Let us know what it turns out to be.
"All riches begin as a state of mind and you have complete control of your mind"  -- B. Lee

Offline 70chall440

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #5 on: May 17, 2020 - 06:08:21 PM »
Yeah thats a good point and strong suspect.
Current Mopar
70 Challenger RT 440-6 EFI, 73 Cuda 416-6 EFI
05 Hemi Durango, 01 Ram 4x4, 14 Ram 2500 4X4, 10 PCP Challenger 6 spd RT, 01 Viper GTS ACR, 52 B3B w/330 Desoto Hemi, 70 Hemi RR (under const)
Past Mopars
9 x Challengers. AAR Cuda, 4 RR, 2 GTX, 4 Chargers, etc... (too many to list)

Offline JayBee

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #6 on: May 17, 2020 - 06:20:38 PM »
Decades ago I had a bad orange ECU that would kill the car after driving around for a while. Replaced it with a black ECU and it's been fine ever since. Luckily there were non-Chinese ones available back then.

The dealership had to troubleshoot it because after replacing everything I thought it was I never suspected the ECU since it was less than a year old at the time.
John

1970 Barracuda convertible
2000 Toyota Avalon

Offline 70chall440

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #7 on: May 17, 2020 - 09:23:02 PM »
Thats a possibility but in my experience when the ECU goes bad it usually remains that way, not doubting you at all and I can totally believe it; gets hot and something shorts out or becomes disconnected, cools down and its good.

Just something to add to the list.
Current Mopar
70 Challenger RT 440-6 EFI, 73 Cuda 416-6 EFI
05 Hemi Durango, 01 Ram 4x4, 14 Ram 2500 4X4, 10 PCP Challenger 6 spd RT, 01 Viper GTS ACR, 52 B3B w/330 Desoto Hemi, 70 Hemi RR (under const)
Past Mopars
9 x Challengers. AAR Cuda, 4 RR, 2 GTX, 4 Chargers, etc... (too many to list)

Offline 'Cuda Hunter

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #8 on: May 17, 2020 - 11:38:09 PM »
I have had one ecu do that also.  just not very typical. 

Sucks most ecu's and voltage regulators are made in china now.  Or thailand, or some other place ruled by China.   They suck.  My last Voltage Regulator lasted 40 miles.
"All riches begin as a state of mind and you have complete control of your mind"  -- B. Lee

Offline chaps70rt

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #9 on: May 18, 2020 - 08:46:11 AM »
Thanks guys I am just about to head out to the garage and run through the wiring first with the various areas mentioned by all of you.

Next will be the coil.   I believe that I have a spare one, so I will swap it out.  Unfortunately it is raining today and tomorrow here, so I won't be able to road test it until later this week.

I will advise what I found and what steps I did once I get it resolved. 

I MUCH APPRECIATE THE FEEDBACK AND SUGGESTIONS.   Great to know we are one big Mopar team!!
White 1970 Challenger R/T
440 - 4BBL - Shaker
Daily Driver - 2014 Dodge RAM 1500
Stouffville, Ontario Canada

Offline 70chall440

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #10 on: May 18, 2020 - 10:57:17 AM »
Good luck, may the Mopar gods smile upon you.
Current Mopar
70 Challenger RT 440-6 EFI, 73 Cuda 416-6 EFI
05 Hemi Durango, 01 Ram 4x4, 14 Ram 2500 4X4, 10 PCP Challenger 6 spd RT, 01 Viper GTS ACR, 52 B3B w/330 Desoto Hemi, 70 Hemi RR (under const)
Past Mopars
9 x Challengers. AAR Cuda, 4 RR, 2 GTX, 4 Chargers, etc... (too many to list)

Offline chaps70rt

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #11 on: May 19, 2020 - 06:47:28 AM »
Checked the ground on the starter relay . added a tooth washer in behind to ensure I have a good ground.  Checked the coil connections and they were tight.   Ordered a new ECU and Coil from Mancini.  Always good to take a spare at all times.  Opened up the dash and found all the
speaker wires that go to the rear fader open and exposed (cut and taped off as they are not in use).  Will check the fuse box next and road test this coming week and advise.   Thanks guys for your suggestions.
White 1970 Challenger R/T
440 - 4BBL - Shaker
Daily Driver - 2014 Dodge RAM 1500
Stouffville, Ontario Canada

Offline chaps70rt

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #12 on: June 12, 2020 - 06:56:55 PM »
Guys .. someone suggested that I may have a faulty fusible link at the starter relay.    Can anyone advise if there is an easy way to test this?

Was my scenario above possibly a bad fusible link that re-fused after sitting for 30 min???

I would appreciate any feedback you can offer as I have never experienced a bad fusible link.   I suppose just buying a new one
would eliminate the possibility of this being a probable cause.   Does it matter where to buy??   Recommendations??
White 1970 Challenger R/T
440 - 4BBL - Shaker
Daily Driver - 2014 Dodge RAM 1500
Stouffville, Ontario Canada

Offline 70chall440

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Re: Running great then Lost All Power?? Need Help!!
« Reply #13 on: June 13, 2020 - 12:43:27 AM »
Fusible links are like any other fuse, when they go they are gone and you can tell by the melted wire that is the fusible link. I dont remember what size is needed in that application but it is on the wiring diagram I believe.

Ghost problems like starting and running and then not are typically indicative of several types of issues;

- loose connections (coil, starter relay, starter, main power wire in the bulkhead connector)
- corroded connections (same as above)
- bad coil
- broken wires that are not completely broken; meaning there are a few strands still connected (same list as above)

You really need to take an organized and methodical path on this, start at the ignition switch and move through the bulk head connector to the starter relay, etc. stick with it and you will get it figured out.

one thing to take a look at is your distributor, look at the wires and connector first, pull the cap and look at everything inside to make sure nothing is broken, loose or bad.
Current Mopar
70 Challenger RT 440-6 EFI, 73 Cuda 416-6 EFI
05 Hemi Durango, 01 Ram 4x4, 14 Ram 2500 4X4, 10 PCP Challenger 6 spd RT, 01 Viper GTS ACR, 52 B3B w/330 Desoto Hemi, 70 Hemi RR (under const)
Past Mopars
9 x Challengers. AAR Cuda, 4 RR, 2 GTX, 4 Chargers, etc... (too many to list)