Author Topic: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler  (Read 7324 times)

Offline Cudaless

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X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« on: December 02, 2001 - 09:50:40 pm »
Q:I know H-pipes (straight cross-overs) are doable, and that aftermarket kits are out there, but I was thinking about X-pipes. They build more HP, they scavenge better, and they are more efficient = better mileage. I was just wondering about clearance...anyone know?




A:I'm fabbing my own on my '70 RoadRunner, it's all the same underneath . I'm using Hooker Super Comp Plus headers with 1 7/8" primaries going to 3" collector and 3" pipe to a pair of Dynomax mufflers, 3" in and out, and dumping in front of the rear axle. Everything is going to be welded except the mufflers. I got the center X fabbed and welded all the way to the collectors, but I had to order two more 45's to complete the job. The tube on the driver's side has to be fabbed to go around and thru the crossmember so it would shoot straight back and parralel to the passenger side. This has to be done if you're using 45 degree mandrel bends to make the geometry work out. I don't have a picture of it, but if you would like, I can snap one tomorrow and post it.







OK here goes....#1 is 20" center to center, #2 is 27 3/8" from flange to center of X, #3 is 13 1/4" from flange to where the 45's start, #4 is 15 1/2" from CENTER to CENTER(it's very difficult to measure from inside to inside on round tubing and get an accurate measurement), #5 is 90 degrees, #6 is 90 degrees, A1 & A2 are cut to fit from 45's(see text below), B1 & B2 are full 45's with nothing trimmed from them. I'm using Walker part #41428-3" 45 degree bends(6 req'd). A1 & A2 are cut trimming both ends till you get a good fit around the crossmember. I done this by bolting the collectors to the flanges and using the "Ricki-stover" method of fitting. "Ricki-stover" is a reference to fitting pipe by the seat of your pants till you get the fit you want(if it will work for high pressure ammonia and hazardous chemicals, it'll work for this). I am a pipewelder/pipefitter, and have run into situations where the mathematical formulas don't work, so I had to improvise. Hence my nickname of Ricki-stover, I can fit "stovepipe" with the best of them!!! I would like to point out that I had to cut the collector for the driver side so that the measurement from flange to cut is 3/4"(see pic). Once the collectors were bolted on the headers, I started fitting and tacking everything together under the car. I was working alone and took my time with the fitting, took a couple of tries to get around the crossmember the way I wanted. Once everything was fitted, I tacked a spacer bar between the collectors to maintain dimensions during welding(VERY important)!! I'd also like to note that the flanges on the HEADER are NOT square with the world once they are installed on the motor, that's why everything was fit under the car before welding. I'm still waiting for two more 45's to show up before I can finish, and I'll get a pic of the whole thing from the collectors to the mufflers before I install it. You might want to go to a welding supply store a purchase a pipe "wrap-a-round", makes straight cuts for butt welding pipe very easy, as long as you make a straight cut. It can also be used to make your cut lines for the saddles at the X, if you're familiar with pipefitting methods.





Looks great...I gotta have those pipes on mine! I'm going to attempt to fabricate with some help from apipe fitter...we'll see.

Hate to ask, but could you take 3 final measurements?








The dimensions are as follows, #5 is 4 1/2" center to center, #6 is 17 5/8" from center of X to the ends of the 45's where the mufflers go on(for a total length of 45"), and #7 is 21" center to center. Keep in mind that I fit this up to use my particular mufflers. Depending on what mufflers and type of 45 bends you use, you might have to alter some of these dimensions to accomidate your components. But I hope this works for a good place to start, don't be shy about making changes that fit your needs. Good luck, Rick
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 - 07:00:00 pm by 1023595200 »




Offline BadHemi

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Re: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2001 - 08:12:41 am »
That fabbed set you built looks VERY nice! ....An alternative to building them yourself? Get ahold of TTI, I believe TTI (see their banner on the www.moparts.com website) can make you a set ready to bolt on from exhaust flanges to exhaust tips, they can even make them in 3.00" diameter if you like! Now those puppies make some power!
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 - 07:00:00 pm by 1023595200 »

Offline The Cuda Guy

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Re: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #2 on: January 15, 2002 - 10:06:35 pm »
How much HP do X pipes add???

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« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 - 07:00:00 pm by 1023595200 »
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Offline Chryco Psycho

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Re: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #3 on: January 16, 2002 - 06:12:54 am »
they free up more power than a H pipe & are suppoesed to be as good or better than open exhaust ;)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 - 07:00:00 pm by 1023595200 »

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Offline The Cuda Guy

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Re: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2002 - 09:25:26 pm »
WOW!!! Better than open exhaust???  well thanks for the info!

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Offline 68bullit

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Re: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #5 on: January 22, 2002 - 05:46:44 pm »
i read an article in a mopar rag awhile ago stating that h or x pipes didnt really add to performance but rather sound.i dont know if its true but the article was by doug of HEADERS BY DOUG FAME from the 60s.if i can find the article i will post something
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 - 07:00:00 pm by 1023595200 »

Offline The Cuda Guy

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Re: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2002 - 05:59:50 pm »
Sounds like we have a difference in the facts some where???  The only thing I ever heard was that H-pipes ballance the exhaust and makes it sound better...  But what do I know???

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Offline Chryco Psycho

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Re: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2002 - 09:26:40 pm »
I have done H pipe comparisons & they do help mileage & power , I haven`t tried the X pipe YET ::)
« Last Edit: December 31, 1969 - 07:00:00 pm by 1023595200 »

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Offline The Cuda Guy

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Re: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #8 on: February 11, 2002 - 03:32:52 pm »
Any new info on X-Pipes???

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Offline 1973challenger360

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Re:X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2003 - 01:14:05 am »
January  2003 Mopar Muscle  X- files   H pipe to x pipe

H pipe  rpm   x pipe
 horse power
244    3000    249
300    3500    324    +24hp
404    4500    415    +11hp

average hp from 3000-6000
h-pipe 379.8hp  x-pipe 392.3hp

peak hp with h-pipe  5500rpm 454hp
peak hp with x-pipe  5400rpm 466hp

This article is on a 1970 hemi Challenger
1965 barracuda. Was 273/2 904 car had 440 360 in plans
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Offline GhettoPop

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Re:X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #10 on: August 20, 2003 - 11:57:15 am »
in general, x-pipes add a few horses and sound more unique, h-pipes are louder and give u more of that muscle car sound
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Offline jvike

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Re: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2008 - 04:07:38 am »
As the exhaust pulses travel trought the X-pipe they create a vacuum that in turn will draw the burnt gasses out of the cylinder as the ex. valve opens, that will empty the cylinder faster and more effectly so the cylinder can be filled with more clean air for a better combustion in the next cycle. = more Power and better milage.

I saw the effect when I put my TTI X-pipe system on my Cuda 340 some years ago. Floring it from a 35 mhp roll my frind in his stock 84 Rx-7 would keep up with me in my slipstream. The next year when I had put on TTI exhaust we did the same thing, then I would gain slightly on him and he couldn't keep up with me. So it could be the effect of 15-20 hp?

Oh, and my 1/8 mile time improved from a 10.21 to 9.90. But that included a change from 2.73 to 3.23 gears.
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Offline Aracer

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Re: X-Pipes: By Rick Keesler
« Reply #12 on: April 22, 2015 - 12:21:09 am »
The x pipes from Summit work on my 68 cuda 340/ flowbastards 3" collector, with careful trimming and some pre-installation, puffing of the collector end. They have a zoomy sound under the seat, as you take off. Probably some trumpeting (resonance) at the crossover. I like them, they tight to the floor and unseen as hanging from the side view. They will fit the e-body too.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2015 - 02:24:10 am by Aracer »