Author Topic: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!  (Read 6651 times)

Offline 1carhunter

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Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« on: October 22, 2014 - 08:03:24 pm »
I love what the 1970 Hamtramck registry does for the most part.  Barry definitely has a lot of info and seems well respected but what the heck is this stink Barry is putting on cars he or someone their deems are people "illegally selling VIN" of "parted out" "VIN switch" and so on, in the "FOUND" section of his registry??????  Putting people's VIN's in a BLACK FLAG section without supporting documentation!  Come on!!

I would not have known or cared about this but I looked to buy a car yesterday and the owner was ranting and raving about wanted to sue some "a-hole" for besmirching his car on some registry.  After waiting for the guys head to pop off so I could get the car for free, I figured out he was talking about Hamtramck, which I love!  After checking the car over and the paperwork, VIN, etc., I pulled out my lap top and there it was! BOOOOOOM, price goes down!  Should it??  The car was rusty for sure, and missing motor, trans and various other stuff but it IS fixable!  The guy said he had previously advertised it in 2003 or 04 and listed it as clear title, matching VIN and fender tag but pretty much a parts car.  He didn't get his price and decided to keep it.  Then a few years later he was doing some research on his car and saw it on Hamtramck listed as a BLACK FLAG in the FOUND section.  Surprise buddy!

My question for Barry is, what criteria do you use to list the EBay cars (in this case) as black flag VIN frauds cars?  It just doesn't seem right or fair.  Did you inspect them?  Could you share what criteria you use to bottom out these people's car value?

I have seen a lot of cars that get 50, 70 90 % of the metal replaced.  How much is acceptable in Barry's opinion before that car is deemed unworthy???????  I really liked this 70 high impact color 4 spd car but I had to pass until I can get it off the Registry.  THIS SUCKS!!!!!






Offline Topcat

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #1 on: October 22, 2014 - 09:08:16 pm »
I went to Moparts and saw a thread with him and under his name it said "homeless"

True or not, Barry contributed alot.

Devils advocate: I'm sure he made some enemies over time.
Mike, Fremont, CA.


Offline rUNCHARGER

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #2 on: October 22, 2014 - 09:34:12 pm »
Barry's a good guy and he's right. What if your guy had rebodied that car and you didn't know that and paid him full price for it? If the car is a real POS and he is asking the correct price for it he shouldn't be upset at all.

Sheldon


Offline anlauto

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #3 on: October 22, 2014 - 09:34:23 pm »
The "ONE" problem with any person that runs a registry that have so called "black flag" lists is the fact that these lists are made up using one persons opinion. In the case of the Hamtramck Registry, that opinion is that of Barry Washington.

He feels his entitlement to make that opinion based on pictures posted on the internet. By compiling a list of so called "black flags" Barry has accentually appointed himself as the MOPAR POLICE. In some cases the information has help owners make informed decisions about purchases that otherwise they had little to go on.

HOWEVER:
There are "black flags" on his list, labeled as "rebodies" when he has ZERO proof or knowledge of how the car was restored and based"his opinion" solely on the "before" photos found on the internet....which is a crock of sh!t. :2cents:
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Offline anlauto

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #4 on: October 22, 2014 - 09:38:03 pm »
Barry's a good guy and he's right. What if your guy had rebodied that car and you didn't know that and paid him full price for it? If the car is a real POS and he is asking the correct price for it he shouldn't be upset at all.

Sheldon

What happens if "that guy" spent tens of thousands of dollars reconstructing that rust bucket using OE sheet metal and as much of the original car as humanly possible, only to have it publically labeled as a rebody by that "good guy"  who just assumed it was a "rebody" ?
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Offline Topcat

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #5 on: October 22, 2014 - 09:42:49 pm »
Why he ran away from here made no sense.

From what I recollet is that he had an issue here with a higher upper of the website.
He didn't want to "man up" on the situation is what I perceived.
Mike, Fremont, CA.


Offline anlauto

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #6 on: October 22, 2014 - 09:50:40 pm »
I really liked this 70 high impact color 4 spd car but I had to pass until I can get it off the Registry.

 :smilielol: Yea...good luck with that :stomp:
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Offline 1carhunter

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #7 on: October 22, 2014 - 11:37:46 pm »
I don't know about the "Barry being homeless" thing but I see a guy named Johan Ronkainen is helping out to keep the site up while Barry moves his stuff from Alaska, maybe he can help on this matter. 

Like I said, I appreciate all the stuff Barry has put together on his site.  EXCEPT, this EBay non-sense.  I have examined and bought more collector cars than I care to remember and believe I can make the determination (in person) better than some guy sitting at his computer with a couple pictures and some words in an ad.  Sure, it may be helpful for a novice buyer to know that a car was previously offered on line... IF! IF! IF! Barry bothered to post the original ad and photos to let the buyer decide.  If this were the case, I would say bravo Barry, bravo :clapping:.

This really has got under my skin.  I checked this 70 out and the cowl was ligit, the door tag was readable, the dash was crap but the VIN plate was obviously original with star rivets in place, fender tags still attached, radiator support bent up but readable, 20 year old clear title. As stated before, this car was rusty and crusty in and out, no hood, no bumpers, limited interior, no deck lid but rebuildable.  Now, it is a BLACK FLAG car and may never get on the road because of it!  UNBELIEVABLE!  I thought we wanted these beauties on the road????

My suggestion to anyone selling a builder on EBay or craigslist is, DO NOT LIST THE ENTIRE VIN!!!!!  Barry (Mopar Police) may Black Flag your ass!

If any body gets ahold of Barry, ask him to deal with this non-sense.  "I" don't need a daddy.  The IRS has that job covered.       :feedback:

Sorry, one more thing:

Build sheets???  Barry collects build sheet that some people claim came in their car and distributes them to the so called proper owner.  Technically, per Barry's standards, these are not original to the car, so they should be BLACK FLAGGED.  Sure, you found 6 build sheets under the carpet of your Gran Coupe; that just means the assembly line workers used your car as the trash can because they didn't want to soil my sweet Cuda.  :stirpot:



 
« Last Edit: October 22, 2014 - 11:41:50 pm by 1carhunter »

Offline Cuda Cody

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #8 on: October 23, 2014 - 10:16:48 am »
I've found Barry to be a stand up guy and tries to help the hobby as much as he can.  As stated above, it's one persons opinion and he's not making any money on his hobby so come at him with facts and I'm sure he'll want to help correct the situation.  I've heard he saves photos of all the ebay ads so most likely he has the photos of the car and the text used to describe it.  Send him new photos and describe the car as you know it to be fact.  Rust does not mean a car is black flagged.  VIN swapping is what I heard he looks out for.

On a positive note, If you're as good as you say you are with these cars I wouldn't worry about someone else's opinion if you're 100% sure it's clean and not a re-body.  All you have to do is document the car from top to bottom and take lots of photos of the complete restoration process.  Then you'll have nothing to worry about. 

Post the photos of the car and all the documents and I'm sure you'll get someone to help you get in touch with Barry to get this figured out.  Mistakes happen and if he has misunderstood the situation I'm sure he'll correct it.  Let me know if you need help posting photos.




  I have examined and bought more collector cars than I care to remember and believe I can make the determination (in person) better than some guy sitting at his computer with a couple pictures and some words in an ad. 
« Last Edit: October 23, 2014 - 11:26:36 am by C O D Y »
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Offline 1carhunter

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #9 on: October 23, 2014 - 02:40:52 pm »
Thanks for the reply Cody even though I sensed some condescension. :poopoke:  I am not looking for abuse, just some facts.  My being good (which I never claimed) has nothing to do with what Barry deems Black Flagged and/or "illegal sales."  My being "able" to inspect the car in person however,  does matter!  I don't live in Motor City Central Alaska, so I usually go check cars out before I deem them unworthly of buying.  Sometimes I don't check them out but I also don't post that they were "illegally" being sold on EBay either.  I am not currently a DMV investigator and I don't play one on the internet. :bigshades:   If they were actually being sold "illegally" on EBay, all Barry has to do is send "proof" to EBay and they "will" check it out.  They have all the seller's info and are glad to share it with real cops.

I am sure Barry thinks he is just trying to help minions such as myself but sometimes that hurts someone else. I too believe Barry to be a good guy from what I hear and he has developed a quality site but I think he has went afoul in this area.

CONTACT BARRY!!! Does this make sense????  Myself and others should have to whip out our lap tops, check Barry's "FOUND/BLACK FLAG" section that has no pictures or evidence listed and say, "Oh, Barry says you are a criminal.  Sorry, just hold on a second, let me figure out how to contact Barry on his Bat Phone (which I hear is impossible) with all of our photographic evidence in the middle of this buy negotiation just to prove he is wrong!"

Black Flag list (red flag would have made more sense.  just say'n).  Heck, I bet some people don't even know they are on this list!

No, I didn't buy the car yet, (and probably won't) because of the stench Barry put on it. I ran across it while looking at another, didn't buy it either and it wasn't even on Barry's list!.  As noted in my posts, we are all big boys, if Barry would just post the ads and photos HE deems as suspect, that would be wonderful.

If someone actually knows Barry and knows what information he uses for his Black Flag list, could you post it?  I still believe he should just post the information he has gathered and let the real buyers decide.

I would like to see as many of these cars back on the road as possible.  And yes, I like to make money, as I don't do this for charity.  But Kudos to anyone who does.  One way or another, they need to be on the road and not sitting in some pissed off guys shed rotting.  As far as VIN fraud, I will let the professionals that wear uniforms have the last say on that.

Offline anlauto

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #10 on: October 23, 2014 - 02:59:17 pm »
There's one car on the famous "black flag" list that I'm VERY familiar with. THis car was basically rusted to the core. It was restored using as much of the original car as possible along with seperate replacement panels from other doner cars. An extensive amount of labour and mig wire went into getting this car back on the road.

When Barry found the before pictures on the internet and found out it was being restored he placed it on his list as "Rebodied in Canada" which is just a matter of opinion. Was the whole shell replaced with a doner...heck no, but does Barry know, or care....NOPE....it's rebodied in his eyes and that is all that matters.
The owner stopped short of taking him to court to get it remove, but figured Barry and his web site are a pretty small spec of crap in the internet world, and it really wasn't going to make a difference...the car speaks for itself.
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Offline 'Cuda Hunter

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #11 on: October 23, 2014 - 03:16:23 pm »
Unfortunately, Most of the guys who can "notice" the subtle difference's in tags and Fonts on those tags don't tend to post many pictures.
This falls in the same category I believe.

I always ask for pictures of the differences so I can learn something for myself about fraudulent cars, but no one posts pictures.  (well, very few)

Is it marked as a rebody or what?

Maybe Barry will post the pictures.  :villagers: Harass him and get him to post them.   :chatting: :villagers:
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Offline Cuda Cody

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #12 on: October 23, 2014 - 03:46:53 pm »
Could you please post  photos of car including the numbers on the body, fender tag and dash vin? I'm fairly sure that I can get the photos to him now that he's moved to PA and see if I can help you get any mistakes corrected on his site.  That's about the best way I can see to help you.

Do you have any other suggestions to get this resolved?
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Offline Sleepychallenger

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #13 on: October 23, 2014 - 03:54:59 pm »
Doesnt he post a reason why it is listed next to each VIN?

I was wondering what happened, I always enjoyed his posts and he helped me out quite a few times with answers....seems a lot of the old members I knew have departed or do not post very often on here.

Offline RzeroB

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Re: Hamtramck Registry EBay stink!
« Reply #14 on: October 23, 2014 - 04:19:52 pm »
The talking points in this thread bring up a controversial subject - "rebuilt" vs "rebodied". I'm sure it's been addressed before, so bear with me.

For example, you have two desirable cars that are worth trying to restore, but they are very rusty and crusty and need extensive metal work to be saved. Both cars are rusted so bad that they will need to have 75% of the original metal replaced :22yikes:

Car #1 you rebuild it using new metal and donor parts as necessary. When you are finished, very little of the original car remains having had 75% of the original metal replaced.

Car #2 you rebuild it using a relatively rust free donor car. Your donor car is pretty clean so you decide save some work and $$$ by transplanting the good 25% of your original car (including the VIN, cowl, radiator support) to the donor car.

When you are done, car #1 has had 75% of its metal replaced during the restoration using new metal and donor parts and a lot of time, skill and $$$. Car #2 you "rebodied" it by transferring the usable 25% of the metal to a donor car. Six of one half-dozen of another? :dunno: They essentially both have been "rebodied" being that only 25% of the original car remains in either finished car. Where do you make the distinction?
« Last Edit: October 23, 2014 - 04:21:24 pm by RzeroB »
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