Author Topic: How do you guys feel about clones?  (Read 119540 times)

Offline 70chall440

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #315 on: November 29, 2015 - 11:12:45 PM »
all nice.
Current Mopar
70 Challenger RT 440-6 EFI, 73 Cuda 416-6 EFI
05 Hemi Durango, 01 Ram 4x4, 14 Ram 2500 4X4, 10 PCP Challenger 6 spd RT, 01 Viper GTS ACR, 52 B3B w/330 Desoto Hemi, 70 Hemi RR (under const)
Past Mopars
9 x Challengers. AAR Cuda, 4 RR, 2 GTX, 4 Chargers, etc... (too many to list)




Offline Archialfa

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #316 on: December 01, 2015 - 05:44:03 PM »

Funny how so many point to the creativity involved in doing a Restomod when the reality is these days most of the Restomods are cookie cutter.... Open a catalog & order your Alterkation, Order your Wilwood brakes, order your Vintage Air.... Maybe the really cool Carbon Fiber instrument Cluster.... Lets see, a trans from American Powertrain.... Maybe a D60 from Strange... What's next?

Sorry Restomods aren't particularly creative these days... Ten to fifteen years ago when you had to adapt things that never were intended to go together... Then it was creative....  Creative like Feets with his twin turbo 440 powered 65 Fury with AMG Mercedes 14" 6 piston brakes & one off wheels... Thats creative...  These current cookie cutter Restomods... Sorry No...

I get your point, but take a look at it from my (or any other cookie cutter) perspective: I get to be creative at the job that I do whole day long (I'm an architect), I am no mechanic and have very basic knowledge of how suspension should work. I have no garage to take the car apart and the only way for me to enjoy the old school car design with modern driving feel is to pay and have the restomod done by a qualified person.

My opinion is that it is better to have tested and proven products available off the shelf and not having someone experiment with my car and my safety while driving it. I know that those products were thoroughly tested so I see absolutely no problem having them available. If someone wants to experiment and try to put things together that weren't supposed to go together, that's fine by me, but I feel much more comfortable doing it this way.

Having a choice is such a nice thing, no? :-)


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1970 Challenger 440 Magnum

Build thread: http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=113902

Offline 1 Wild R/T

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #317 on: December 01, 2015 - 07:55:40 PM »
I get your point, but take a look at it from my (or any other cookie cutter) perspective: I get to be creative at the job that I do whole day long (I'm an architect), I am no mechanic and have very basic knowledge of how suspension should work. I have no garage to take the car apart and the only way for me to enjoy the old school car design with modern driving feel is to pay and have the restomod done by a qualified person.

My opinion is that it is better to have tested and proven products available off the shelf and not having someone experiment with my car and my safety while driving it. I know that those products were thoroughly tested so I see absolutely no problem having them available. If someone wants to experiment and try to put things together that weren't supposed to go together, that's fine by me, but I feel much more comfortable doing it this way.

Having a choice is such a nice thing, no? :-)

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I hear you but I wish the guys building & selling these kits felt as much responsibility for the safety of their customers as the customers buying the stuff initially believe they do....   

My suggestion, look at Hotchkis, It's based on the original Chrysler design but with improved geometry... Get a Firm Feel stage 3 box, again based on Chryslers orginal steering box design but greatly improved feel & feed back... No not 100% equal to rack & pinion but allot closer than many give credit for.... Hell Mercedes & BMW used steering gears into the early 2000 time frame... Done properly it can't be that bad... & contact Dr Diff for your brakes...  He offers kits based on OE components so...

A) they are factory engineered components
B) parts are available locally...

If your car has a stock power booster keep it, the aftermarket CP unit everyone sells is a piece of crap..
JS27N0B 70 Challenger R/T Convertible  FJ5 Sublime, Show Poodle w/90,000 miles since resto
WS27L8G 68 Coronet R/T Convertible  PP1 Bright Red, Project
RM21H9E 69 Road Runner Coupe R4 Performance Red, Sold...
5H21C  65 Falcon 2 dr Wagon... Dog Hauler...

Offline 70chall440

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #318 on: December 01, 2015 - 08:03:49 PM »
I do agree with these points. I assisted a buddy on a Magnum Force setup in a Cuda for a customer; have to say I am not impressed at all and would never buy one of their setups or send someone to them. I think there are a number of offerings out there that are less than ideal (or safe even).
Current Mopar
70 Challenger RT 440-6 EFI, 73 Cuda 416-6 EFI
05 Hemi Durango, 01 Ram 4x4, 14 Ram 2500 4X4, 10 PCP Challenger 6 spd RT, 01 Viper GTS ACR, 52 B3B w/330 Desoto Hemi, 70 Hemi RR (under const)
Past Mopars
9 x Challengers. AAR Cuda, 4 RR, 2 GTX, 4 Chargers, etc... (too many to list)

Offline Archialfa

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #319 on: December 02, 2015 - 02:33:32 AM »

I hear you but I wish the guys building & selling these kits felt as much responsibility for the safety of their customers as the customers buying the stuff initially believe they do....   

My suggestion, look at Hotchkis, It's based on the original Chrysler design but with improved geometry... Get a Firm Feel stage 3 box, again based on Chryslers orginal steering box design but greatly improved feel & feed back... No not 100% equal to rack & pinion but allot closer than many give credit for.... Hell Mercedes & BMW used steering gears into the early 2000 time frame... Done properly it can't be that bad... & contact Dr Diff for your brakes...  He offers kits based on OE components so...

A) they are factory engineered components
B) parts are available locally...

If your car has a stock power booster keep it, the aftermarket CP unit everyone sells is a piece of crap..

I have no idea what my car has because I still didn't get it.  :o

Anyway, thanks for all the info. Basically you answered all of my questions - I wanted to know if RMS is worth the price difference compared to Hotchkis. I will be going with Hotchkis TVS definitely, the whole kit.

1970 Challenger 440 Magnum

Build thread: http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=113902

Offline soundcontrol

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #320 on: December 02, 2015 - 07:01:33 AM »
I have no idea what my car has because I still didn't get it.  :o

Anyway, thanks for all the info. Basically you answered all of my questions - I wanted to know if RMS is worth the price difference compared to Hotchkis. I will be going with Hotchkis TVS definitely, the whole kit.


I think that is a good idea. I'm going Firmfeel, thats more than enough for my sunday cruisings  :)
I'm sure AlterK is a great system but somehow it did not feel right to me to totally change the suspension system to a system that the car wasn't made for, just a gut feeling I had when I made the desicion.
/ Ken
Restoration thread: http://www.cuda-challenger.com/cc/index.php?topic=102525.0
topic=108917.new#new

Offline Brillo1974

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #321 on: January 10, 2016 - 11:29:36 PM »
I bought my Challenger because I always wanted one and it didn't really matter what year it was, body wise and trim wise they all looked the same (other than colors). Mine was a 318 car from the factory but it was one of the last Ralley (April 1974) cars built and in a rare color. I got it from a guy in Oregon and it had a 360 in it and was pretty much original and had all it's original sheet metal. I could have taken it back to stock but why? I put what I wanted in the engine changed drivetrain parts and exterior trim to what I liked. I do keep it looking stock but with stock aftermarkets parts. I took it to shows this summer and won 6 out of 8 times, 2 best Mopars, 2 first places in my class, a top 30 and a top 50. In the one first place I beat out two 1970 Plumb Crazy Challenger RT's (very nice cars) sitting on each side of me at a Midwest MOPAR show! One actually sold at Barrett Jackson. Does that tell you anything? Build what you want and enjoy it, it will still run and drive the same as the original with the same parts in it. Once the cars left the factory VERY few stayed original and still aren't unless they are survivors ..... then prove it to me. Original points, plugs.... you get my drift. If it is then it doesn't get driven like they were meant to be, clone or whatever you call it I love the cars.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2016 - 11:32:33 PM by Brillo1974 »
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Offline 734406pk

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #322 on: January 11, 2016 - 12:11:43 AM »
 :iagree: Build it the way you want it! It is your car. The difference is grilles and tail lights IMHO.
1973 Challenger 440 6 pack auto 3.91 rear
2012 Dodge Ram 3500 dually 6.7 Cummins Fleece EFI Live
1973 Challenger 318 2bbl auto 2.73 rear 22.5 mpg RIP
1970 Challenger TA 340 4bbl auto-Sold and sad
1999 Dodge Ram 3500 dually 5.9 Cummins Fleece tuned VGT-sold
1995 Kawasaki ZX1100E & still alive

Offline 340challconvert

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #323 on: January 26, 2016 - 10:57:56 AM »

I think that is a good idea. I'm going Firmfeel, thats more than enough for my sunday cruisings  :)
I'm sure AlterK is a great system but somehow it did not feel right to me to totally change the suspension system to a system that the car wasn't made for, just a gut feeling I had when I made the desicion.
I like the Firmfeel route for the same reason. I would like to have them rebuild my original box to level 2. Not looking to do Autocross, just have my car feel a little tighter, while keeping mostly stock.
1970 Challenger A66 Registry

Offline 70chall440

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #324 on: January 26, 2016 - 12:18:34 PM »
I like the Firmfeel route for the same reason. I would like to have them rebuild my original box to level 2. Not looking to do Autocross, just have my car feel a little tighter, while keeping mostly stock.

I would recommend you look at going stage 3, everyone I have talked to that had a stage 2 has said they wish they had gone stage 3. It isn't twitchy or crazy sharp.
Current Mopar
70 Challenger RT 440-6 EFI, 73 Cuda 416-6 EFI
05 Hemi Durango, 01 Ram 4x4, 14 Ram 2500 4X4, 10 PCP Challenger 6 spd RT, 01 Viper GTS ACR, 52 B3B w/330 Desoto Hemi, 70 Hemi RR (under const)
Past Mopars
9 x Challengers. AAR Cuda, 4 RR, 2 GTX, 4 Chargers, etc... (too many to list)

Offline Katfish

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #325 on: January 26, 2016 - 05:48:54 PM »
I like clones BETTER than original cars.

Speaking of steering, I just did this mod.
Simple, low cost, big improvement.
I have some extra shims if anyone needs some.

http://www.moparaction.com/Tech/beep/PUMP_IT_DOWN-re-v1.4.pdf

Offline Mpdlawdog

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #326 on: January 27, 2016 - 01:05:28 PM »
I like clones BETTER than original cars.

Speaking of steering, I just did this mod.
Simple, low cost, big improvement.
I have some extra shims if anyone needs some.

http://www.moparaction.com/Tech/beep/PUMP_IT_DOWN-re-v1.4.pdf


Im interested in this...how big of a difference did it make?  what size did you use??  I am getting ready to put a rebuild box in mine...dont have the cash for a firm feel rebuild right now.......

Offline Katfish

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #327 on: January 27, 2016 - 05:50:49 PM »
It reduces the line pressure, so steering effort is increased.
I like the difference, gives it a tighter R&P feel.
I followed the article and added 3 0.020" shims for a total of 0.060".
The shims I got on Amazon are 0.020" each, they have different values if you really wanted to fine tune it.
But that would get expensive.
I'm very happy

Offline JoeGrapes

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #328 on: January 28, 2016 - 09:06:28 AM »
I did the mod with the shims. I played with different thickness and it sort of worked. My steering box was 40 years old so it needed to be replaced. I tried getting a police box from the local NAPA store and I went thru two of them because they leaked and to be honest just didn't feel any different. So I brought it back and got a refund. Then I bit the bullet and went with Firm Feel Stage 3. I put the stock shim back in the pump so I could make a better comparison. The Firm Feel box is WAY better than the shim change in the pump or the police box. I didn't try a Stage 2 box but from the way the Stage 3 box feels I know I would have been disappointed with the Stage 2. The car is just a street cruiser. 

Offline Katfish

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Re: How do you guys feel about clones?
« Reply #329 on: January 30, 2016 - 08:55:39 AM »
I have no doubt the FF box is a big improvement.
But the price for that is +$600
You can do this mod for $6
Is the FF box 100 times better, maybe.

This was a quick, simple, inexpensive change for me.